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Another bad fire burns a town to the ground

Discussion in 'The Main Board' started by Atlas, Nov 9, 2018.

  1. twp

    twp Moderator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    I'm not assuming to speak for hypnos, but I've long considered CA to be a potential problem, even when I lived there. High population density areas which depend on food transport from the central valley and fuel from southern/central CA wells and refineries.

    If the food/fuel lines are disrupted, where will the people go? Some (many?) will not be able to leave the state via automobile and that will create the proverbial "golden horde" which will be looking for food.

    In southern CA, the mountain passes to Nevada/Arizona will remain open in winter which is a large corridor for the refugees. Northern CA pass may also be blocked with snow in winter.

    In summer months, the southern passes will be hot zones due to temperature and low water supplies, while the northern passes will be both temperate and have plenty of water.

    If a (food/fuel) crisis lasts more then a month, starvation and rioting will begin to reduce the population. Reason to move out of those high pop. density areas, now.

    Another concern is how the national guard and police forces will respond. If they attempt to contain people, they will be eventually overrun unless they can offer food and shelter. Much depends on what aid may be coming from outside the state.
     
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  2. hypnos

    hypnos Well-Known Member Survival Class Instructor

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    I'll give my pick, tomahawk Wisconsin, (ie project tomahawk) as an example.

    I'll start with firearms laws.
    In Wisconsin there is zero wait period unless buying fully automatic, suppressed, or short barrel rifles or other NFA items. And in my locality there isn't even a case law, you can travel loaded, vehicle or open carry to your hearts desire and it is one of the most trouble free states to aquire a CCW.

    No tax on food, very low taxes across the board. A quick trip to Minnesota will allow you to purchase clothing without tax.

    The government and municipalities of Wisconsin have budget surplus not deficits. Beyond that, i made more money and paid much less tax owning my own business than any job i have had previously.

    Cost of living is extremely low, and wages are better than most of the country with many entry level jobs paying around $15.00 per hour.

    I was not forced to pay for medical insurance...
    Instead i would go to an Amish doctor if need be, he had a small practice but it contained all of the modern equipment and standards any other clinic would. My price for the doctor visit with a perscription for antibiotics??? $55.00
    Chiropractic visits??? $100 for sign up and then $25.00 per vist for the rest of my life.
    Dental??? Excellent and free at the local college.
    Still not convinced???

    https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/40-On-Four-Mile-Rd-Tomahawk-WI-54487/2088332966_zpid/

    This sesrch took 30 seconds, roughly $50,000 for 40 acres of land....prices you'll never see in Cali even if you had a time machine.
     
  3. hypnos

    hypnos Well-Known Member Survival Class Instructor

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    Local growers and survivalists abound. To me it's paradise. Most city's dont even require a building permit for many types of construction. No smart meters, and very very low crime outside of Milwaukee.
    I personally think Wisconsin is the best kept secret for preppers. Need to bug out? Tomahawk is a stone's throw from the UP and canada. And there are vast tracts of public land to hunt or tromp around in,
    The cons: it is cold.(split and seasoned wood by the cord runs about 50$ or less) there are packers fans And the farmland to the south of tomahawk is known for tornadoes on occasion...that's about it.
    Before i left WI, a carton of eggs, or a gallon of Milk cost 1.00 at kwiktrip. Fuel prices are average. Wisconsin DMV is like Disneyland compared to any other place I've lived....god i miss Wisconsin...
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2018
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  4. hypnos

    hypnos Well-Known Member Survival Class Instructor

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    No permit needed to buy a gun as a WI resident. You walk in, pick and ar15 or handgun what have you, pony up the cash, and walk out with it after the background check. This isn't an exaggeration, my last gun purchase took 15 minutes from darkening the door to hitting the street and i walked out with no case with a long gun in the middle of town...what a thrill. My favorite is seeing people getting ready for a deer drive on a stretch of dirt road, about 25 or 30 people and 50% carrying ar15 style rifles. :) hahahaha. Then a horse drawn carriage with wooden wheels goes by. Rural Wisconsin is a different world.
     
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  5. Atlas

    Atlas Administrator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    I dont think that California is a great place to be, but I seriously doubt that it's the worst either.

    I'll say this. I can collect water and grow food in my back yard with hardly any soil amendments for only the cost of the seed. There are some states that this is possible, but not all. It's also not illegal for me to catch that water. On top of that I can grow food from May until November.

    As for the prices, I cant move anywhere cheaper than where I am and live cheaper. Housing prices in Nevada can be low, but the income potential is low and that doesnt make it attractive. Oregon, Washington, Arizona, Utah, Idaho, Montana. None of them are THAT MUCH cheaper for housing, and food all seems to cost quite a bit more. Especially further east.

    I'm armed well enough, that isn't a concern at this point. The fuel is more expensive here, but I dont drive all that much.

    If it comes right down to it, I'd rather deal with the maybe of a golden hoard while having food and water easily in hand than live in a "prepper friendlier" place.
     
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  6. hypnos

    hypnos Well-Known Member Survival Class Instructor

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    If you are already dug in than, sure. There are plenty of bad places to be for a prepper in any state in the country. I agree about the mountain states, i had considered settling in some place in the mountains but for me the price is beyond my means. But, again, if you aren't in the middle of a major city center you are probably fine regardless of where in the world you happen to be.
    I like the PNW, but it wasn't all i thought it would be. The midwest is probably the most affordable place to find property, Wisconsin, for what it offers is only the best I have found so far, that doesn't mean their isn't some place that could be better. i have traveled the country extensively and have read a good amount of information from people who are heralded as experts on the topic of relocation for the purpose of going off grid and being more independent, i visited the very places mentioned and found that in reality vs. Spreadsheet data Wisconsin is the best choice for me. The growing season isn't bad at all where i have lived in Wisconsin, and a greenhouse can extend my growing season as long as a Californian. Beyond that, local food, livestock, and agricultural equipment are everywhere for purchase or trade. The economy is stable and the wages are good. Plentiful job market and lack of skilled employees has caused excellent wages. Before i left i was considering on renting a house. For 450 a month plus utilities. That's pretty darn good.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2018
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  7. twp

    twp Moderator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    I found CA to be expensive but I lived in the Bay Area. I moved to the Sierra foothills, north of Sac. and prices were lower but not low enough, so I left for Nevada.

    Re the northwestern states; they used to be a lower cost of living area. I'm looking at the "Northern Redoubt" states and see that housing prices are rising due to the influx of people leaving the West Coast states (CA, WA, OR). I still like the Redoubt area because of the better mindset and more conservative politics. WA and OR are still too liberal for my taste and I've lived in both.

    If I make another move, it will be to Montana, Wyoming or Idaho, in that order of preference. And that is always dependent on circumstances.

    I'm not attracted to the Eastern US states due to population density and politics so they are not on my list of possible destinations (pre-event).

    I was born in Colorado, have also lived in Arkansas, New Mexico, Washington, Oregon and California and now Nevada, so I have some experience with all of those states. I do watch the news and follow the changes in the atmosphere of each area.

    Obviously, we each have our preferences and opinions on where to live. I'll not say any are really wrong, but I do have my own opinion on just about everything... :p
     
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  8. hypnos

    hypnos Well-Known Member Survival Class Instructor

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    As do most people I'm sure. Everyone has their particular comfort zone. If you live in a state that resembles a powder keg, all the more justification for tricked out bug out vehicles and bags, you may be more likely to actually need them then the rest of us. I don't know if that's good or bad :/
     
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  9. twp

    twp Moderator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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  10. Atlas

    Atlas Administrator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    We had a pretty good rain storm roll through yesterday. It was impressive. I knew those down there in Paradise were going to have a rough time because of it. We have more in the forecast too, so I hope they get help or move on soon.
     
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  11. twp

    twp Moderator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    We got that storm here also. Snow is due in the morning.
    Not good weather to be trying to rebuild, but I suspect the few in Paradise are near ready to start that work. Insurance, if they had it, will take at least several weeks to come down the pipe and if they area is snow bound, nothing will happen until spring.
    As you noted, I hope the evacuees have a place to stay.
     
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  12. twp

    twp Moderator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    This is something to be aware of:

    Insurer goes bust from Camp Fire with millions in claims outstanding. How will it affect Paradise homeowners?

    https://www.sacbee.com/news/state/california/fires/article222563185.html

    The State of California may take over the claims but not only is there an upper limit on payments but California is bankrupt to begin with.

    Does your insurance policy really cover the cost of recovery from such total loss?
     
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  13. jimLE

    jimLE Well-Known Member

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    Looks like everyone of them.is losing their shirt in every way possible.
     
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  14. Atlas

    Atlas Administrator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    I figured this might happen. I wonder when the federal aid is going to roll in.
     
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  15. twp

    twp Moderator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    Probably no rush because I don't think rebuilding will happen in winter. However, those people need food and shelter right now.
     
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  16. hypnos

    hypnos Well-Known Member Survival Class Instructor

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    I was trained to sell insurance and during that training i discovered some of the darkside of the industry. Clauses are in place to prevent insurers from being forced to pay out if during acts of war or terrorism etc. And personally, a wrongful death suit with a insurer refusing to pay saying it was the fault of the policy owner is by far the worst and most frustrating, suing your own insurance company (suing yourself as crazy as that sounds) is a complicated and long process, what little you have left will be gone before you see a nickel. It's a terrible place to be, to pay and pay and then when you need the service, the answer is no.
     
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  17. Atlas

    Atlas Administrator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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    I've had this happen with auto insurance in the past and I'm sure that home insurance is the same. It's a scam.
     
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  18. twp

    twp Moderator Staff Member Survival Class Instructor

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  19. jimLE

    jimLE Well-Known Member

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    And extra water in each vehicle as well.

    Those foks deffintly had a bad time of it.especially the folks from the Nursing. home and in bad health
     
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